Thank you so much for the feedback. I understand most of what you have indicated here.

Interesting solution. I went to Gem because ofelia seemed to be less in favor and not being updated?

@alexandros said:

I think Pof, which embeds openFrameworks (much like Ofelia did), runs on a different thread (I think). But I have tried closing its window and that crashes Pd. But I could be wrong, as I could be doing this the wrong way.
Switching back to another external that embeds OF, since you have switched from Ofelia to Gem, can be discouraging. I just thought of mentioning that Pof runs on a different thread (I think).

@alexandros

Hey, I am doing as you exactly point out. I am opening Gem before the concert set begins. I have not yet tested the concert to see if that creates additional dropouts.

Now your other idea to run Gem somewhere else, sound enticing. I am not sure I am "knowledge" to be able to do that right now, but I like it.

@ddw_music said:

Well, if you load a large audio file while sound is playing, you can get dropouts then too.

That's a 97.3 MB file -- "audio I/O error." Only vanilla objects in the patch. Sending that read message does glitch the audio.

So this isn't "a Gem issue."

Since Pd is single-threaded and the control message layer runs within the audio loop, heavy activities in the control message layer can cause audio processing to be late. Reading a hundred MB of audio? Opening a window and preparing it for graphics rendering?

AFAIK the available solutions are: A/ structure your environment so that all heavy initialization takes place before you start performing -- i.e., start Gem before your show, not during. Or B/ Put Gem in a different Pd process (which doesn't have to be [pd~] -- you could also run a second, completely independent Pd instance and use OSC to communicate between them). (Smart-alecky suggestion: Or C/ Move your audio production over to SuperCollider, whose audio engine shunts heavy loading off to lower-priority threads and whose control layer runs in a separate process, so it doesn't suffer this kind of dropout quite so easily.)

"Except that dropout when you create and destroy. Wish that could be changed" -- sure, but the issue is baked into Pd's fundamental design, and would require a radical redesign (of Pd) to fix properly.

hjh

Maybe it is quarantining then. I changed the pathway to where the file is but the folder was not recognized by Pd. Perhaps, and very likely, Mac is doing things to make the folder not findable.

Hey,
Maybe this is with all externals, but I have been looking into transferring patches to other computers. I do not understand why, and I assume there is a reasonable explanation.

The patches I have made, I merely just transfer to the new computer. Easy. The patches that are externals, at least in deken, but maybe others as well have to be downloaded again. I tried just moving all of the files to the new computer (I am using macs). I put the files in the location where all the files were documents/Pd/externals.

As I write this, I realize the name of the account might be different which might be the reason Pd cannot find the files. Or is it that the files have to be recompiled.

I am not sure if I had to recompile the files the last time I changed computers which was in 2018 or 2019. I transferred my entire account from one computer to another computer.

Is it common to have to recompile? I assume so. Is there a way around this? At the same time, it might be good to recompile so that I can get any updates from the last time I got the externals.

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated so that I can understand better.

Ha!!!! Yeah. . . I perform live while performing. I am already at a 50ms delay, which makes performance a bit challenging to say the least. I am also trying to get the delay shorter more like 25ms.

Thank you for the confirmation. I appreciate it.

I have changed all of my patches from ofelia to GEM. It seems to be working fairly well. I am pleased. Gem seems to be somewhat fragile.

It can crash the system.

It does not seem to take up too much CPU and can run in the background. I am currently pleased.

Except that dropout when you create and destroy. Wish that could be changed.

So, I am switching all of my visuals to GEM from Ofelia. It seems to mostly be working.

I do have a question. When I am using audio I cannot create or destroy a GEM window without getting digital distortion/dropout. Is that just the way it is? Am I doing something wrong?

Well that is reasonably the reason why.

And we are now on .56-2, and ofelia seems to continue to create problems.

What are others using when trying to have access to pdfs or jpegs and want to show them on a screen when using pure data without creating digital clicks in sound.?

Also, I can duplicate the file, change the name, and then open up the new file.

I think it might be a result of using ofelia.

Hello,
There is a patch I am working on that works and that I can save in the same name, but in Pure Data if I try to "Save as" a new name Pd crashes.

Here is the error that I am seeing before it crashes:
(Tcl) UNHANDLED ERROR: bad window path name ".x600002764900"
while executing
"tk_getSaveFile -initialdir $initialdir -initialfile [::pdtk_canvas::cleanname "$initialfile"] -defaultextension .pd -filetypes $::filetypes -parent..."
(procedure "pdtk_canvas_saveas" line 3)
invoked from within
"pdtk_canvas_saveas .x600002764900 {RECORDwTITLE.pd} {/Users/williamraynovich/Documents/Pd/PureDatainformation} 0 "
("uplevel" body line 1)
invoked from within
"uplevel #0 $docmds"(Tcl) UNHANDLED ERROR: bad window path name ".x600002764900"
while executing
"tk_getSaveFile -initialdir $initialdir -initialfile [::pdtk_canvas::cleanname "$initialfile"] -defaultextension .pd -filetypes $::filetypes -parent..."
(procedure "pdtk_canvas_saveas" line 3)
invoked from within
"pdtk_canvas_saveas .x600002764900 {RECORDwTITLE.pd} {/Users/williamraynovich/Documents/Pd/PureDatainformation} 0 "
("uplevel" body line 1)
invoked from within
"uplevel #0 $docmds"

It seems to be something about the path of the RECORDwTITLE object?

Can anyone easily see what the issue is.

Thank you. This is what I was looking for. The help from a few years ago was helpful. I am on to the next step in this process. I am guessing that those who intend to have others use their patches use MAX/MSP?

You have been very helpful.

So, as I am looking at one way to do this, I could put objects that I am using for a specific piece into a folder where I open that piece and do something like this:

declare -path ./name_of_folder_that_I_put_objects_in

Is this what you all do? Or do you not really share complex patches with others to perform?

@alexandros Also, with this, I am more trying to make my patches be able to be used by others more easily. I have to make sure the computer that I am transferring the patch to has all the external objects already downloaded. I was/am hoping there might be an easier way.

Hello,
Yeah I fixed that. I remembered that one and it did help and it has been going well for me.

I am seeing if there is an elegant solution to make it so that I do not have to go in to the Pd patch when using a different computer with a different user ID and change the pathway even in the declare way of making the paths?

So that if I send the Pd patch with all needed objects to another person it will automatically work.

Does that make sense?

Thank you, I am trying to work on this.

I realized that pd pathways seem to be a bit odd or I am doing something wrong. The name on my mac is:

/Users/raynovich/Documents/Pd/externals/NAMEOFFOLDERorPDfile

I think that is how the "data structures" of MacOS systems work? So, if I have to change to a different User name or I want to give a performer my composition to perform than they would have to get all those permissions set up.

Am I doing something wrong?

Maybe there is an easier way?

I am having to change computers, but also I want to have the ability to put my patches on other computers for others to perform my works. I have been delaying figuring out how to do this elegantly, but I now need to consider how to do this.

So, in the spirit of that, I have the computer I have been using for six years with a list of paths that I have added which makes all of my patches work. It is a bit of a mess with more folders than I probably should have but nonetheless.

If I am unable, in this case I am not, to transfer my entire Apple account to the other computer, is there an easy way to get all of my preferences to a different computer easily? Do I have to do it manually?

I hope these this question makes sense.